Dampening Systems

[lterry]

We have had several comments regarding Dampening Systems...I thought about starting a poll to see what type/brand of dampening system is considered the "most popular" or "used more than others". Then I thought...."Have we come to the point in archery that says...all manufacturers should add some type of dampening system to their product?" Then..I thought, "Why do they add them?" My next thought was: "If the product is designed and manufacturered so that dampening systems are not absolutely necessary...unless an archer prefers to add them...why should all archers have to pay for the added expense?

Another thought I had was: "Do all archers want the same dampening system?" If a bow comes with a dampening system...do you aways use that system? ...or do you remove it and put a different one on your bow? ...Or do you just "add" another type?

Have archers been "trained" to think that a bow cannot perform properly if a dampening system is not on it? When you look for a new bow....do you only concider bows with dampening systems already on them?

I also think about string silencers....do we all use the same ones? Should a company add these? Are you aways going to use the ones that may come on your bow? ..or are you going to change them and put the kind that you perfer on your string?

This is just me...thinking out loud and wondering what other archers think... :)

[Tejas Raz]

Lots to chew on, ya know?! :new_rofl:

Ok, here goes. Jim Rumps of www.SelectArchery.com have talked some on this subject and as a result, I have put BowJax on my Elite to see what difference, if any, they would make... yes, I KNOW the Storm Elite really doesn't need any dampening. I've been shooting mine without much at all by the way of dampening except for a couple of string silencers that Edgell installed before sending it to me, and an extremely minimal SIMS stabilizer module to hold my wrist sling. I also installed an STS to stop the string slapping noise. Both together DO quiet the bow even more than it already was! I will play some more with the STS off the bow and back on to get some more data.

*"Have we come to the point in archery that says...all manufacturers should add some type of dampening system to their product?"
YES! Unfortunate, but totally true!

*"Why do they add them?"
Most manufacturers HAVE TO! Read the bow test reports and at least 50% of the time (or more!), some comment will be made that "with the addition of xxx brand of silencing modules, this bow is really quiet." The meaning is that without them thingies, THE BOW IS FRIGGIN LOUD! :(

*"Do all archers want the same dampening system?"
Maybe not the same, but I'd venture to say the answer is YES to some kind of dampening system.

*"If a bow comes with a dampening system...do you aways use that system?"
Probably, until the latest super-hi-tech-wiz-bang gizmo comes along that we "can't live without!" :D

*"Have archers been "trained" to think that a bow cannot perform properly if a dampening system is not on it?"
See above 3 questions! It's not only training, but experience with their own bows and the effects a good silencing system can have on them.

*"When you look for a new bow....do you only concider bows with dampening systems already on them?"
Without a doubt, since the archer has been "trained", some kind of silencing system is a must have accessory that must be bought. If the system comes on the bow a la BowTech, Hoyt, Alpine, Mathews... well, durn near everyone, then the bow that comes with them will get the nod because the buyer doesn't have to add anything. It's turn key. Note also the advertisments of those bows... it's advertised as to come with these items as "freebies". Value added!

*"I also think about string silencers....do we all use the same ones? Should a company add these? Are you aways going to use the ones that may come on your bow? ..or are you going to change them and put the kind that you perfer on your string?"
Lump these all together as I've already covered them mostly. String silencers are pretty much a part of the "package". Two manufacturers advertise speed enhancement with their string silencers! Note that the BowJax string silencers also mention a 1-3 fps speed gain! I'll try this out on my chrono too.


So back to Jim and my conversation. One customer was hemming and hawing between two bows. One came with the "silencing package", the other didn't. He liked the bow that didn't better, but "knew" that he had to have these things... and so, bought the bow that came with them. Our questioning followed yours above. And the thing that came out of it? Until there are other bows on the market that do not need silencing items, you WILL NOT convince the archery public that they aren't needed. I also recall a thread a few months back on AT that we both participated in that this very subject came up in. I remember clearly that there was no way you would ever convince folks that a bow could be made that didn't need them! Until that happens, the subject is moot.

So how much would it cost to add them to a package? And... can a manufacturer AFFORD not to offer them, if it COSTS sales! The answer is clear to me. Just the way it is in this rarified air we call archery land... It's not about relevance, it's about MARKET!

[Tejas Raz]

Oh, by the way... I'm pretty impressed so far with the BowJax products! LimbJax, StringJax, Cable Guide Rod Dampener, and ThumbSaver.

www.BowJax.com

[lterry]

TR...

Good points...I agree with your line of thinking... :)

I guess my "out loud" thinking was to see what types of systems the general archer likes. I have researched Bowjak products and agree that the company has a quality product. I have talked with Jim on the subject too.

I have had several suggestions sent to me...but just wanted to put these questions out there for archers to respond as to the type of system that they prefer. As we continue to work on our '07 line we encourage our shooters as well as other archers to give us their input on these subjects. :D

[AJL]

Im waiting on the damp(edge) system. :D we all know he can do it. Andy

[lterry]

Im waiting on the damp(edge) system. :D we all know he can do it. Andy


:D :new_rofl: :new_rofl: :new_rofl:

[Tejas Raz]

That's pretty good Andy! :new_rofl:

But if ya know Edge, er ET.... we already got the Edge system! A BARE Storm bow, without all the funny rubber thingies! :D


Come on folks.... post up some opinions. I wanna hear them!

[buck]

I will say that the hush kit I got on the f-6 on-lee lost 4fps but is so quit!!! you can hear a mouse
fart & @65-29 I'm see 275 & it"s not paper tund yeat .

p.s no wrist sling need!!! let see mathuws do that

[Hoosieroutdoorsman]

For myself and alot of the people that bring me their bows to work on and make them shoot a little better I will say that a decent stabilizer and a set of Limbsavers or LimbJax whatever you prefer are more than sufficient. String silencers? Thats where I fall away from the rest of the crowd, I have played with alot of string materials and found some to be alot noisier than others. The strings I build don`t require any string silencers, alot of the people I build them for are shocked because they are so used to having to have them it isn`t funny. I see some of the manufacturers adding alot of gadgets to new bows, are they adding them because they need them? Or as security blankets for the folks that buy them? Or are they just adding stuff to up the retail price? In my opinion I think it boils down to how the individual is going to set up and shoot the bow, a heavier arrow will quiet a noisy bow considerably more than an IBO weight arrow. I have noticed with the BCY string materials if you wax them often with a good silicone based wax they are alot quieter, Brownell string materials come very waxed and I have found them to be more of a soft and quiet shot. I have seen 2 identical bows but set up differently for 2 people and 1 was whisper quiet and the other sounded like a 22 rifle. I think the manufacturers should leave it up to the customer to get the add ons as needed,,just keep working on building a quiet bare bow and let the masses do as they will with it.

[selectarchery]

Londa,
Glad that you posted this. As stated, I have had customers choose a bow with dampeners over those that don't have them. I think that testing will show that bows with the dampeners are more quiet in regard to decibel noise. There are bows that are produced, the Elite included, that are very, very quiet to begin with...but adding silencers makes it that much more quiet.

I have found that customers will put on dampening equipment even if it is not on the bow that they want, BUT I have seen times that a bow choice came down to which one had dampeners and which one didn't when they are at similar price points. If they get one without dampeners, then they are looking at around $20-30 to put it on. That pushes the price of the Elite, for example, pretty far above what others are paying for the top Pearsons and the top Bowtechs (just using two lines that have similar price points, depending upon the area, and use dampening products).

For manufacturers, it isn't that much of an added cost. Sure, it would cost a bit more in labor to put them on, but it only takes an additional minute to put these products on. Give Becky at Bowjax a call. They have something for 07 that is simply awesome in regard to durability and dampening.

The perceived benefit, and real benefit, for the customer justifies the minimal cost to the manufactuer. I think that's why you see more manufacturers putting them on the bows. If a bow sale is lost over dampeners, then the cost is huge. If a bow sale is gained (which is what I have personally seen), then the benefit is huge.

I know there may be some dealers that put up a false fit about wanting to sell the customer the dampeners...do they turn down selling Bowtechs, Pearsons, Bear, Newberry and others that use the dampening systems? No way.

That's just my 2 cents...thanks again for putting this up!!!

Jim

[lterry]

Jim...

Thanks for your input on this subject. We want to hear what our dealers think as well as what shooters think about these systems. This subject along with my thread on what shooters would like to see in the new '07 models gives us an idea as to what our customers would like us to do.

Although I am not at liberty say what Storm is planning on doing....the input here on the tech forum does have influence on our product lines.

Come on guys....even if you don't shoot Storm Bows....we would like to hear what your thoughts on this subject is. :D

[Rhoades]

I have a NOS '03-04 F-6, it was made under the old ownership, I am trying svl super leeches for the string, and carbon rod stabilizer with a make your own extra weight on the end (in the process of machining my own). Its quiet with just those mods to it. I dont believe that a manufacturer needs to put dampeners on a bow. I think there are to many options for people to have to settle for what comes with the bow. While I also believe that the manufacturer should make a quality product also.